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Tim Miller
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:07 am 
   
TS02_05champ wrote:
Quote:
Ray O'Hara wrote:
In the wake of failed talks with Penske over Saturn GM has announced
it will discontinue the brand.
2600 dealers nationwide will be closed too.

More like 350 dealerships to be shutdown and 13,000 jobs lost.

Long as they're "union jobs", the country wins.
 
Riley 77
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:26 am 
"Mike Marlow" wrote in message
news:5ef2c$4ac3f145$4b58a6e3$10985@ALLTEL.NET...
Quote:
"Ray O'Hara" wrote in message
news:ha0qo3$evk$1@news.eternal-september.org...


you are a fool.
when the unions are gone the middle class will follow and we'll be
Mexico.


Oh please. What percentage of the middle class is represented today?

--

-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@windstream.net


Ray....dude...$61 an hour PLUS bennies PLUS health care when you are
retired, for cars that are pretty worthless at 50,000- 75, 000 miles?


Not a blueprint for success.

If Roger Penske can't turn it around....no one can.
 
Ray O'Hara
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:42 am 
"Riley 77" wrote in message
news:CzTwm.3846$tl3.1711@nwrddc01.gnilink.net...
Quote:
"Mike Marlow" wrote in message
news:5ef2c$4ac3f145$4b58a6e3$10985@ALLTEL.NET...

"Ray O'Hara" wrote in message
news:ha0qo3$evk$1@news.eternal-september.org...


you are a fool.
when the unions are gone the middle class will follow and we'll be
Mexico.


Oh please. What percentage of the middle class is represented today?

--

-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@windstream.net


Ray....dude...$61 an hour PLUS bennies PLUS health care when you are
retired, for cars that are pretty worthless at 50,000- 75, 000 miles?

that's a lie.
 
Ray O'Hara
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:44 am 
"TS02_05champ" wrote in message
news:4ac3ff54$0$23973$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com...
Quote:
Ray O'Hara wrote:
In the wake of failed talks with Penske over Saturn GM has announced it
will discontinue the brand.
2600 dealers nationwide will be closed too.
More like 350 dealerships to be shutdown and 13,000 jobs lost.



http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2 ... aturn.html
 
TS02_05champ
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:11 am 
Ray O'Hara wrote:
Quote:
"TS02_05champ" wrote in message
news:4ac3ff54$0$23973$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com...
Ray O'Hara wrote:
In the wake of failed talks with Penske over Saturn GM has announced it
will discontinue the brand.
2600 dealers nationwide will be closed too.
More like 350 dealerships to be shutdown and 13,000 jobs lost.



http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2 ... aturn.html


Did you even read what you just posted from *April* 27th?


http://dealbook.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/ ... n-from-gm/

http://money.cnn.com/2009/09/30/news/co ... 2009093017

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/bus ... 46057.html
 
RickyBobby
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:08 pm 
"Ray O'Hara" wrote in message
news:ha0jna$j5f$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Quote:
In the wake of failed talks with Penske over Saturn GM has announced it
will discontinue the brand.
2600 dealers nationwide will be closed too.


From the beginning of time until the present time GM has not exactly had any
success with small cars.

Their first attempt at a small car was the Chevrolet Corvair which was
derided as being "unsafe at any speed" and discontinued.

Their next attempt was a tin box known as the Vegas which is best recalled
for having and engine that was woefully underpowered and constructed of a
strange mix of aluminum and iron parts. GM did not get the recipe right
because the Vega engine generally did not last for even 30K miles.

Then they tried the Monza which was unique in the the engine had to be
halfway removed from the car just to change the spark plugs.

The Pontiac Fiero came in two flavors. There was a four cylinder model that
could not get out of its own way and a brawnier six cylinder model that had
the odd design flaw of often setting the engine compartment afire.

The sole bright spot, at least by GM standards, was the Cavalier. That
model did last for a long time, in more ways than one, until it was replaced
by the uglier than sin Cobalt which nobody buys. I believe that there has
been a four door Cobablt but I have never actually seen one because I
believe it would look like a Cobalt coupe that had been beaten with an ugly
stick.

And then we come to Saturn. A cheap Chevy with plastic fenders and not one
other feature that was of any possible interest to anyone who was interested
in cars. The Saturn line will not be missed by anyone not employed by
Saturn.

In other words, the next good and profitable small car that GM builds may be
very close to being the first good small car GM has ever built. I do not
include the GEO line of cars that were briefly sold at Chevy stores because
they were not built by GM. That line of Suzukis or Isuzus or whatever they
were was not very memorable in the first place.

So if you expect the Chevrolet Volt or Chevrolet Cruze to be a world beater
you are going against a very long track record of almost total failure.
 
Mike Smith
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:08 pm 
On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 23:42:09 -0400, "Ray O'Hara"
wrote:


Quote:
Ray....dude...$61 an hour PLUS bennies PLUS health care when you are
retired, for cars that are pretty worthless at 50,000- 75, 000 miles?

that's a lie.

Nope
 
TS02_05champ
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:08 pm 
RickyBobby wrote:
Quote:
Their next attempt was a tin box known as the Vegas which is best
recalled for having and engine that was woefully underpowered and
constructed of a strange mix of aluminum and iron parts. GM did not get
the recipe right because the Vega engine generally did not last for even
30K miles.

I had a '75 Vega that had 75,000 miles on it before I sold it, and I
never had one problem with it.
 
Mike Smith
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:08 pm 
On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 19:48:14 -0400, "Ray O'Hara"
wrote:

Quote:
Hey, they're union. Who the fuck cares? They brought it on
themselves.



you are a fool.
when the unions are gone the middle class will follow and we'll be Mexico.

True but that does not change the fact that they did indeed bring this
on themselves with their ridiculous collective bargaining agreements
all these years, with each one being worse than the previous ones.
 
John McCoy
 Post subject: Re: Goodbye Saturn
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:08 pm 
"Mike Marlow" wrote in
news:5ef2c$4ac3f145$4b58a6e3$10985@ALLTEL.NET:

Quote:
"Ray O'Hara" wrote in message
news:ha0qo3$evk$1@news.eternal-september.org...


you are a fool.
when the unions are gone the middle class will follow and we'll be
Mexico.


Oh please. What percentage of the middle class is represented today?

Difficult question. About 12% of the working population is
represented by a union. About half of them are in government
employ. The bulk of the remainder are in relatively high wage
jobs (railroads, phone company, etc). So I would guess that
most unionized workers fall into the middle class. It's
probably a fair estimate to say 10% of the working population
are unionized middle class workers.

John
 
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